Something longtime readers have probably figured out by now is that I am kiiiind of a big Free/Open Source Software fangirl. I make every attempt to use said software when I can, and this affects everything from my browser to my image editor to my IM program to my word processor to my entire operating system. In fact, the reason why I am on Linux is not so much that I’m some sort of computer wizard, because I’m really not– it’s that it’s one of the best ways I can think of to support an ideology that I love.
Because of this, a lot of things that many people take for granted are off-limits to me, and it’s something I am okay with. Shandara’s Hunter DPS Spreadsheet and its predeccesor Cheeky’s have always been some of those things. I’d have to jump through hoops to get Excel installed on my system– too many hoops, in my opinion– and the Open Office versions (when there have actually been Open Office versions) lack a lot of functionality. And so yours truly has always been Spreadsheet-less. And it always made me feel a bit awkward when I would get requests to “Make a blog post about ‘The Spreadsheet’!” … since I didn’t use it.
However, it has been brought to my attention by both Lethal Shots and Improved Tracking that a version of said Spreadsheet is now available online… no Excel required.
I immediately hopped over to test it and was quite pleased with it. You can import your character from the Armory and then do things like tweak your spec or your pet’s spec or your shot rotation and see what the resulting theoretical DPS is. It even includes some fun options such as “Test your DPS with the current 3.2 PTR changes”.
So far I’ve learned that whether or not you are raid-buffed makes a big difference in determining whether you want 1/2 or 2/2 Go for the Throat (At my gear level, 1/2 is sufficient in a raid, but not for mostly solo or small group stuff), and I have also learned that Mortal Shots really isn’t worth a lot as a Beast Master. I’ve always felt awkward only putting 2 or 3 points in there rather than the full five, but anyway I put it, going 5/5 Mortal Shots as opposed to putting those points elsewhere (like in Survival) was a DPS loss… assuming you’re fighting something trackable, of course. So that made me feel a lot better about that.
I also learned that wearing my shiny new Conqueror’s Scourgestalker pants over my old Valorous Cryptstalker is also a slight DPS loss because I lose the +5% pet damage set bonus. I wonder if it would still be a DPS loss if fully raid-buffed. I didn’t check that. /ponder
ANYWAYS! I’ll stop yakking about it and encourage anyone to go check it out and play around with it! The great thing about it is that its results are customized for you and your gear. But remember: it’s not the bible, just a guide!
And a great big THANK YOU and /hugs to whoever made it, enabling us non-Microsoft folks to finally enjoy Spreadsheety goodness! <3 (P.S. the site seems relatively self-explanatory to me, but if I get a lot of requests for a more in-depth "how to" regarding it, I'll provide one. So leave a comment if you're interested in that!)
Hey, pretty nice Pike! It actually put me lower than I usually reach, to be honest. Usually I sit around 6500-7500 DPS, and it had me at 5400, which was kinda strange….. still, it’s a really interesting too. In fact, I’ve never really used DPS Spreadsheets because A) they’re more work than they should be and B) they’re always inaccurate for me. (Dunno why, I know a lot of people that get spot on results, I just break the mold I guess). The big plus about this one is that it’s very easy to use, and can actually do most of the setup work for you! That cuts down the extra time dramatically, and it gives you a comprehensive report on what it based things on, allows you to customize your rotation, etc. etc. It’s pretty sweet, honestly. I’m glad to see someone had the forethought to make an easily used one.
Oh my, that is awesome! I use a Mac and don’t have Office at home on my laptop, and half the buttons/functions seemed to be broken in Mac Excel when I tried it at work -_-
So… yay!
I’ve been using the Excel spreadsheet, and it is indeed a DPS loss if you lose the 5% pet bonus when fully raid buffed… as BM, anyway. I’ve been keeping all of my Cryptstalker so I can swap them in and out as I get better gear. Currently, I’m wearing 3x Scourgestalker and 2x Cryptstalker for both 2-set bonuses; I’ll have to re-evaluate whether the 4-set bonus is better or not when I get another piece of Scourgestalker.
Heya Pike! Yeah I agree I think this is awesome!! When Zeherah posted up on the Lodge about it I couldn’t wait to get the word out. Just so happened I posted it up on WoW.com today also! Who’da thunk it! lol
I think it’s a great resource also. Especially for those who don’t have Excel *cough*
BTW – if your readers find any bugs or anything, there’s a forum over at The Hunting Lodge for people to leave comments and stuff (http://forums.brigwyn.com/viewforum.php?f=161)
Anyways, great stuff as always! 🙂
oh lord, it’s turning out to be another expensive night as I poke around with BoE replacements and gemming and socketing and enchanting stuff that needs it. This sort of presentation lets me see the impact of a few major changes. On the plus side, be.imba doesn’t point and laugh quite as much as before.
Wow, thanks for finding this out, Pike! /needs
Now if only I could find a druid one as well. XD;
Oh. My. God. I love you forever for pointing this out. Also whoever made it since it is just awesome.
I haven’t had a fully working version of the spreadsheet since, like, the beginning of Wrath. I’ve got a Mac version of Excel, but it’s still missing a ton of the functionality. (Like, none of the buttons work so you can’t import from the armory, re-test shot rotation, etc.)
The nice thing? The numbers I got from the site are actually dead-on for what I do in game as opposed to my half-working spreadsheet giving me over-inflated numbers.
This site makes the min-maxer in me squee with joy. XD (And the site feels so much less clunky to use than the spreadsheet does on my computer.)
I’ve had this in my bookmarks for about a week now and I’m pretty much using it exclusively over the Excel version. I run Open Office, so I don’t have the full functionality of the actual spreadsheet though it works well enough for my purposes, but the HTML version is great.
So far I’m just using it to determine DPS fluctuations through gear choices. I haven’t futzed around with talents yet as I’m quite happy with my current spec.
The real eye opener really is just what a colossal difference raid buffs make, and which ones are must-haves (and so hurts when you don’t have them); Hunters really do scale from buffs in an impressive way.
I wholeheartedly recommend that all raiding Hunters bookmark this and use it.
Thank you, thank you, thank you for saying the that shreadsheet should be used as a guide, not treated as gospel. I get extremely irritated by people who use the ‘Spreadsheet’ as a reason to say this is better than that and whatnot. It’s a great tool for helping one determine what gear they should shoot for or to smooth our their rotation but everyone’s playstyle is different and I think a lot of people forget that when they quote it.
Very true Shagrat. In something as volatile as WoW I don’t there is anything that should be treated as “do it this way to win”. The entire idea behind RPGs is that everyone can custimize their characters. Sure some will be stronger & have better synergy in the skills, but that’s where the experimenting comes in to play.
Also, for Noah, I also recommend this for the small group players like myself. It’s a good way to see roughly where you’re sitting at plus its a cheaper way to experiment with talents, gear, etc as compared to spending the gold in-game.
Thanks Pike! It’s cleaner and more intuitive than Cheeky’s, I think. I tend to keep a couple things in bags to swap in and out (Greatness, Mirror of Truth, and Fury of the Five Flights, for example), and this makes it easy to compare (Greatness> Mirror>FotFF, btw). Also, one of our hunters asked about switching to Marks for Trueshot Aura and how it would benefit the raid, and this spreadsheet means I can tell him it adds 7% to my dps, for example.
Thanks again!
I tried it with my 80 in pretty much fresh stuff, a purple or so and I got 3k+ dps as a bm spec sorta modeled after yours. First of all, is that even reasonable? I know I am skinning and lw so I have the chants and buffs from that but seriously-even with raid buffs I shouldn’t go from 1.5k on a test dummy to 3k+ in a raid….should I?
Donovitch, the spreadsheet is only a guide and models damage based on more or less optimal conditions (ie zero latency, and a stand-and-shoot fight with no gimmicks, adds etc where you can hit every shot the nanosecond it becomes available – though the Excel version has a field for latency where you can adjust it so it approximates the impact of that on your dps, not sure if the web version has that).
Basically, look at the spreadsheet as calculated theory, whereas the game is the in practice part. Your in-game DPS will not match what the spreadsheet says, but it may come close on a fight like Patchwerk (that’s usually where my DPS is closest to what the spreadsheet tells me, but even then, in-game I’ve got latency to deal with).
So, to answer your question, no, you will not go from 1.5k on a dummy to 3k in a raid. But, in a raid your DPS should probably be around or slightly higher than the 2k mark if you’ve got good buffs and are Hit capped (I’m not sure if the spreadsheet factors in misses due to being under the Hit cap in damage calculations) and you play well.
Dummy damage is always lower than raid damage since you don’t have buffs there, and depending on your spec certain talents don’t affect the dummy (Improved Tracking, possibly Piercing Shots if the dummy is at low health, etc).
Don’t use the spreadsheet as an indicator of how much DPS you will do. The best use of it is to see how different pieces of gear, gems/enchants, talent choices and buffs will impact your DPS. I’m not confident that the damage modeling from glyphs is trustworthy given there are so many variables that cannot really be covered in the spreadsheet.
@ Donovitch – The spreadsheet saying 3k in a raid as a fresh 80 with a good spec and set of glyphs honestly wouldn’t surprise me, seeing it tells me 4.5k raid-buffed. As Noah said, the spreadsheet is assuming you are working under optimal conditions (the best possible buffs you can get from every source) and are basically playing like a robot– perfect reaction time, etc.
On my first ever jaunt into Naxx as a Beast Master, wearing my shiny blues, I hit 3.3k on Patchwerk. Of course, that was before they nerfed Beast Mastery =P But getting close under optimal conditions wouldn’t surprise me.
This is great… the only thing I’m missing from the Excel version is the gear planner section where it shows theoretical +/- dps for different pieces of gear in each slot. It’s quick, and it’s handy. But, the one big thing that the online version has is that its tons more user friendly. Really, just load from the armory and you’re off and running. Even though I know my way around the Excel version, it can be daunting to a new user to try and get it up and running even with the instructions at the front.
Ok so it is under “ideal” conditions. I can live with that and though I know if I played survival and marksman that I could do far more damage supposedly, I still love my beast mastery spec. I have always loved my lil cuddlies and with the current feel of BM it is sorta like playing frisbee with my pet over crits and such. What I am trying to get at is even as BM spec can I still do viable damage for naxx runs in a semi-casual guild? And exactly what numbers should I be getting theoretically to get viable dps in naxx 10 assuming I am a decent player and good at watching for cooldowns, buffs and such? Sorry for the wall of text.